Donna Britt, the black female metro columnist for the Washington Post who, by coincidence, happens to write frequently of and to black females, shares with us today her teary-eyed ecstacy caused by attendance at conventions of minority journalists. “I felt similarly Wednesday at the Unity convention,” Britt writes. Felt similarly? Oh well. (At least I think the column was by Donna Britt. But given Jack Shafer’s devastating putdown of the Post for fawning over the minority journalists convening in Washington, it’s possible this column is actually a Shaferian spoof. It’s hard to tell.) Anway, Britt or whoever writes:
Studying the throng [at the Washington Unity conference], one might naturally ask: Who knew there were so many? So many newspaper, TV, radio, magazine and interactive journalists united by a word that, considering their numbers, suddenly seems absurd:
“Minority.”
Britt also observes:
Although most of the faces would have been considered “black,” they were amazingly diverse.
But if the diverse are themselves diverse (as of course they are), what is the sense of any organization providing preferences and special privileges to a small number of them in order to provide “diversity.” Wouldn’t three “diversity” hires/admissions/whatever who happened to be similar provide less “diversity” than, say, only one of them in combination with two others selected on the basis of some non-racial characteristic?
Britt mentions “a survey released Wednesday by the Unity consortium that showed that 90 percent of the journalists working in the nation’s Washington news bureaus are white — in an America whose citizenry is fewer than 70 percent white.”
Whose citizenry is fewer? Oh well.
Britt concludes:
At some point, it seems, diversity shouldn’t be a goal.
It should be a reality.
Do you think that, misty-eyed, she’s imagining that glorious day somewhere over the time horizon when, according to a New York Times survey mentioned here, Democrats will no longer outnumber Republicans 12
– Britt concludes:
–
– At some point, it seems, diversity shouldn’t be a goal.
–
– It should be a reality.
—
Their “goal” (proportional representation) is racist, sexist, and unattainable as long as foregners (legal and illegal) arrive at our shores at such great rates.
I just don’t understand the nature of the uproar. Why should the immigrants, today mostly uneducated and illiterate in their own language (which is most assuredly *not* English) be proportionally represented as CEO’s (or engineers or anything else except unskilled labor)? The entire debate is senseless and stupid.
Diversity *is* a hate movement, pure and simple. It’s hatred against anyone not considered “diverse”, there being exactly one such group, straight white males.
I expect the poster “nobody important” and several others probably support the diversity movement no matter how blatant and extreme the discrimination. Although their hatred has the upper hand now, they have torn down the very legal foundations that would protect them. And I expect that when the “diversity movement” is no longer useful to the very rich, they will sow what they have reaped. In this case it will be well-deserved poetic justice.
The entire so-called “civil rights movement”, to the very last black man and women, is opposed to the very notion of Civil rights, as shown by their nationwide opposition to CA Prop 209 (which was a slight re-write of the 1964 CRA). When they are gone, they will be gone for good. And they are already gone. It’s ironic to say the least.
Rich
I doubt that Nobody Important will fit so neatly in the pigeon hole you try to put him in.
Obviously “diversity” is a code word for bypassing civil rights law and equal protection, and eliminating the rule of law. “Diversity” is so vague and poorly defined that what it actually means is whatever the person in charge wants it to mean. This arbitrary type of authority is a throwback to absolute rule of medieval times, or to the dictatorships of the third world.
What does “diversity” really mean?
One thing it can’t possibly mean is the diversity of individuals, whether genetic or any other kind of diversity. If it could, then every company, any college, and every country, would be at utmost diversity for its size, inasmuch as each individual is unique. Eliminating the other possibilities, it means anti-caucasian race-baiting and public action. The courts which established the diversity defense are smarter than Slobodan Milosevic, and he knew what he was doing in the balkans.
Huh? Is there another nobody important posting here? I think I’ve clearly staked out a position agaisnt AA, quotas, and other forms of racialism.
I take this position as someone who knows black people and knows they do not need the condescension and coddling liberals are offering them. The liberal stereotype of blacks as hapless victims who cannot possibly make it without the help of government does not square with the black folks I know and admire.
“Huh? Is there another nobody important posting here? I think I’ve clearly staked out a position agaisnt AA, quotas, and other forms of racialism.”
Perhaps I’m thinking of some other poster. Where do you stand on ‘diversity’? And please don’t quote the dictionary, WRT the diversity movement, it lies.
“I take this position as someone who knows black people…”
Guess all black people are the same, eh?
Perhaps you can explain this. I saw a television spot of Ward Connerly speaking to a black audience. He was on the defensive and was being accused of being a traitor to the “black race”. Can you explain this to me? Why would black students accuse Ward Connerly of being a traitor to the “black race”?
It was clear that at least some blacks (and I suspect that it’s the majority) demand racial preferences and oppose actual Civil Rights quite strongly. Promising Affirmative Racism for blacks got Clinton the Black vote, I think there’s sufficient evidence that shows the black support of Affirmative Racism.. As someone who knows black people, perhaps you can explain to me why they oppose Civil Rights for folks like me. I’d appreciate it.
Thanx
Rich
Fleming posted:
“What does “diversity” really mean?”
Do a google search, you’ll find that it means anyone not a non-hispanic straight white male. Diversity is good, non-hispanic straight white male’s must be very very bad. Perfect diversity means that you don’t have any.
Rich
Rich, you need to take a deep breath. Nobody Important’s knowledge of black people is that they do not need AA. Why are you asking her to defend what she doesn’t find defensible?
This is fascinating. One of the reasons many African Americans like myself feel that Ward Connerly is a “traitor to his race,” is the fact that Ward has made himself a millionaire simply by being the brown-skinned face of throw-back, reactionary, pro-white conservative politicians and think-tank groups.
http://www.mediatransparency.org/people/ward_connerly.htm
The vast majority of African Americans I know DESPISE Ward Connerly. The isolated few I’ve met who don’t, tend to be cut from the same cloth as Connerly…mercenary, sycophantic, and dedicated to acquiring personal weath and prestige from white benefactors no matter the cost to those who share his ethnic origin.
Judas Iscariot sold out Jesus for thirty pieces of silver. Ward Connerly has simply taken inflation into account.
–Cobra
This is fascinating. One of the reasons many African Americans like myself feel that Ward Connerly is a “traitor to his race,” is the fact that Ward has made himself a millionaire simply by being the brown-skinned face of throw-back, reactionary, pro-white conservative politicians and think-tank groups.
http://www.mediatransparency.org/people/ward_connerly.htm
The vast majority of African Americans I know DESPISE Ward Connerly. The isolated few I’ve met who don’t, tend to be cut from the same cloth as Connerly…mercenary, sycophantic, and dedicated to acquiring personal wealth and prestige from white benefactors no matter the cost to those who share his ethnic origin.
Judas Iscariot sold out Jesus for thirty pieces of silver. Ward Connerly has simply taken inflation into account.
–Cobra
This is fascinating. One of the reasons many African Americans like myself feel that Ward Connerly is a “traitor to his race,” is the fact that Ward has made himself a millionaire simply by being the brown-skinned face of throw-back, reactionary, pro-white conservative politicians and think-tank groups.
http://www.mediatransparency.org/people/ward_connerly.htm
The vast majority of African Americans I know DESPISE Ward Connerly. The isolated few I’ve met who don’t, tend to be cut from the same cloth as Connerly…mercenary, sycophantic, and dedicated to acquiring personal wealth and prestige from white benefactors no matter the cost to those who share his ethnic origin.
Judas Iscariot sold out Jesus for thirty pieces of silver. Ward Connerly has simply taken inflation into account.
–Cobra
If you believe in special preferences for particular ethnic groups, you are bound to hate Ward Connerly. And you will mistakenly take him to be a “traitor to his race.” But if you are for special preferences, not only are you the one who is a traitor to his race, but you are also a traitor to the concept of equal opportunity and equality under the law. That makes you a traitor to the only legal system that has half a chance of working in a society that contains dozens of different ethnicities, religions, and cultures.
Laura posted:
Rich, you need to take a deep breath. Nobody Important’s knowledge of black people is that they do not need AA. Why are you asking her to defend what she doesn’t find defensible?
—
OK, I took a deep breath.
And the issue not whether black people “need” Affirmative Racism, but whether they want it, whether they demand it. Read Cobra’s response and let me know if you have any questions.
As for what she opposes, I don’t know whether she opposes ‘diversity’ or not. I know many people who say that oppose AR, but support diversity. Now either “nobody important” can clarify, or the question will remain open, you don’t seem to be an authority on NI’s views insofar as this distinction.
Rich
Rich, I admit I’m confused as well as to what you’re asking.
You wrote that “diversity is good, non-hispanic straight white male’s must be very very bad. Perfect diversity means that you don’t have any.”
You think that nobody important, or for that matter Cobra, supports that?
Nels Nelson posted:
You wrote that “diversity is good, non-hispanic straight white male’s must be very very bad. Perfect diversity means that you don’t have any.”
You think that nobody important, or for that matter Cobra, supports that?
—
I’m confused as to what you are asking as well. I was characterizing what diversity actually is, not what I think right and good.
And it seems crystal clear that Cobra supports Affirmative Racism, my guess is without limit and forever. I’d be shocked if he did not support ‘diversity’ and all it stands for as well.
If there’s any black racism Cobra can see or will object to I’ve not seen any evidence of it in his posting. If there’s anything any white can do that he will not find some evil in I’ve also not seen it. His complaints are against whites, not sexism or racism. And he jumps from ‘rich whites’ to all whites mid-sentence, his condemnation is not of those who do wrongs, but of whites. Do you have any issues with this kind of blatant racism? Or do you just find fault with those who object to it?
What, exactly, do you object to?
Rich
Nels,
I concur with your statement. For some reason…I STILL can’t figure out why…but for SOME REASON, posters in support of destroying Affirmative Action think that by doing so, America will become some kind of wonderland of harmony and fairness. Will there be some revolution of interracial commerce, fraternization, and cooperation?
I want just ONE…just ONE REAL, FACTUALLY SUPPORTED justification for that belief. I think anybody who’s read any of my posts so far here KNOWS I can fill this page up with link after link of documented research PROVING the existance of racial discrimination against minorities right NOW in America, despite having Affirmative Action in PLACE.
Please. I just want to know. Please explain to me what’s supposed to happen Tommorrow, if ALL AFFIRMATIVE ACTION ended at Midnight Tonight.
And please cite me historical examples to support your statement.
—Curious Cobra
Fleming,
Give me evidence that America has always treated, and always will treat minorities with fairness and equality, and I’ll concede you the point, apologize and support the removal of Affirmative Action.
That’s all you have to do.
–Cobra
Cobra Wrote:
Judas Iscariot sold out Jesus for thirty pieces of silver. Ward Connerly has simply taken inflation into account.
—-
What kind of bigot thinks that ending racist and sexist discrimination BY THE GOVERNMENT is selling anyone out?
I’ll tell you what kind, a racist bigot who profits from said racism. Do you profit from said Racism Cobra, or do you simply hate whites and support anything that would hurt them? As I said in another post, you lot have already destroyed the exact laws that would protect you from what you advocate. And someday when it bites you in the ass, you will deserve it. It’s the kind of shit you’ve advocated and supported (against whites) all your life.
Face it Cobra, not only are you a bigot, you are damn proud of it.
I’ve met another bigot of your stripe, she claimed that the only reason anyone would appose Affirmative Racism is because they hate blacks. You and she’d get along famously.
Rich
Cobra Wrote:
I concur with your statement. For some reason…I STILL can’t figure out why…but for SOME REASON, posters in support of destroying Affirmative Action think that by doing so, America will become some kind of wonderland of harmony and fairness. Will there be some revolution of interracial commerce, fraternization, and cooperation?
~~~
This is some silly myth made up by the bigots who demand Affirmative Racism. It’s the most irrelevant rhetoric I’ve ever seen, it’s not even an argument. Affirmative Racism is wrong, period, in all it’s forms, to any degree, no matter how slight. It needs to be ended BECAUSE it’s wrong. I know you can’t understand that discriminating against white men is wrong, so I’m not gonna waste my time trying to explain to you something you cannot understand.
And it’s not like you’d support justice for whites anyway. Clearly you oppose the very notion of Civil Rights for whites, which Affirmative Racism completely destroys, by federal mandate. But given that you think white men *should not have Civil Rights*, tell me why you think blacks, women, and foreign nations should have them? Affirmative Racism and diversity put foreign nationals before white American men, which must be an orgasmic situation for you.
BTW, you lot were claiming that Prop 209 was the literal re-institution of slavery. Ignoring for the fact that by and large the State has ignored it, I still don’t see the slavery. Would you be so kind as to post a link to the new slavery for me?
Rich
Cobra Posted:
Give me evidence that America has always treated, and always will treat minorities with fairness and equality…
—
Since you don’t think whites should have this right, right NOW, why do you think this some telling point?
And just FYI, white men *are* a minority in many places, whites are now a minority in California. Tell the truth, you don’t give a damn about minority status, you hate whites regardless of their representation, and you’d deny them Civil Rights in all cases. If discriminating against whites is not a problem (and you demand it), explain to me why it’s wrong to discriminate against blacks or anyone else?
Either racist discrimination is right or it’s wrong. If it’s not wrong to discrimiante against whites, it’s also not wrong to discriminate against blacks.
Not that I expect you to understand an argument about right and wrong mind you. But it remains the core of the problem. You remain either a bigot or a hypocrite (or both, which is my observation).
Rich
Rich,
You failed to answer my question. Not only did you fail to answer the question, but you attacked the person asking the question, trying to discredit the argument by calling me “racist against whites.”
Isn’t that the same straw-man style of debating tactic many conservatives accuse civil rights advocates of?
If I said “I think the New York City Subway System could be cleaner”, would you interpret that to mean “I think all New York City Subway riders are slobs?”
I guess you would. I’m still trying to figure out what your angle is. Are you going to tell me that white males have been at a DISADVANTAGE in American society?
I guess the conclusion here in this blog is that the overwhelming evidence compiled by over two and a quarter CENTURIES of American Society is all false, and that, somehow…minorities now and have always held the MAJORITY of WEALTH, POWER and PRIVILEGE.
That must also make me a “racist”, for believing in social programs designed to help minorities compensate for SCIENTIFICALLY PROVEN racial biases in society.
Again, you folks can call me anything you like. I will continue to list the facts and figures supporting my arguments.
–Cobra
What you are asking is a non sequitur. It is totally irrelevant to the issue at hand.
There has never been a perfect society and never will be. Utopianism is a fraud. The incompetent commit a multitude of new wrongs every time they try to correct for past wrongs. New crimes to be avenged.
That is what affirmative action, as practiced now, is. An unconstitutional crime to be avenged at some future date. I am sad to say that this affirmative racism bigotry will be avenged, either through more ridiculous “corrective” law, or through extralegal means. That is unfortunate but inevitable.
By trying to correct a past wrong with present wrongs you make future wrongs inevitable.
My favorite race preference argument is, “We need race preferences because America isn’t color blind. I’m going to stand here holding a sign that says ‘I’m black. Give me special treatment.’ until people stop noticing that I’m black.”
Nobody has taken the question on. Nobody will answer my simple question as to what will happen tommorrow if Affirmative Action is ended tonight. You would think that people so dead set upon eliminating preference programs would be well versed in what the consequences of removing them would be. Apparently, the best most can do here is say, “two wrongs don’t make a right..all discrimination is bad..yadda yadda yadda…”
Affirmative Action has been around about 40 years in one form or another, and there are STILL BLATANT examples of racial bias and discrimination against minorities. And what of the preferential treatment received by the white majority for CENTURIES in America?
http://newpittsburghcourier.com/?article=4378
Again…I’m still waiting for an answer to my question.
—Cobra
Again, your question is a non sequitur. It is irrelevant to the issue at hand. No society is perfect, and none ever will be. There will always be instances of racism in even the best societies, as long as there are distinctions between races to be made.
The intelligent and wise person would ask himself how he could make the situation better without making it worse.
Your solution to racism merely creates more racists of every color. You create far more racial discord by your actions than would exist without your actions.
What you want is payback, not justice. But payback only creates more need for further payback.
Ok, nobody WILL take on Cobra’s question: What would happen if AA ended tonight?
Black Americans will rise to the occasion using their abundant gifts and talents (and the courts when BLATANT DISCRIMINATION bars their way) and earn entry into all of America’s institutions by hard work, perseverance, and perhaps a little luck just like any other INDIVIDUALS. Just like most blacks today. Most blacks are not poor; most blacks do not live in the inner cities; most blacks are not on welfare; most blacks are law-abiding, hard-working, productive citizens.
Who knows they might run for president, give speeches before major political conventions, win elections to state and national office, accept Cabinet positions, become doctors, lawyers and learned jurists, economics professors, journalists and publishers, scientists and engineers, small business owners and corporate leaders. In short, succeed in all their endeavors, limited only by their intelligence, determination and imagination.
Or they might wallow in their victimhood, blame ALL their failures on racism, believe that they cannot make it in America, fall prey to demogogery, look for easy solutions to tough problems, rely on others for answers, fall victim to drugs or alcohol, crime and other social problems. Either way it is the choice of INDIVIDUALS as to how they will respond to life’s challenges.
But don’t listen to me I’m nobody important, the mongrel bastard of the refuse of Europe, beneficiary of unfair privilege who never earned a damned thing in his life and got by on his good looks and charm, not to mention the easy comradarie of being white.
Fleming,
>>>There has never been a perfect society and never will be. Utopianism is a fraud. The incompetent commit a multitude of new wrongs every time they try to correct for past wrongs. New crimes to be avenged.
Nobody Important,
First I want to thank you for answering the question I posed. I might not agree with your answer, but at least you took a stab at it, which is more than I can say for others.
I find something interesting in your post, however.
>>>Black Americans will rise to the occasion using their abundant gifts and talents (and the courts when BLATANT DISCRIMINATION bars their way) and earn entry into all of America’s institutions by hard work, perseverance, and perhaps a little luck just like any other INDIVIDUALS.
Fleming is right that there will always be injustice.
But we need to try our hardest not to institutionalize injustice in our laws. That is the problem with affirmative action. It is institutionalized racism. By legalizing racism, against the meaning of the constitution, you institutionalize injustice in the very way that injustice against blacks was institutionalized in several states until the civil rights laws.
Cobra seems to mean well, but he is somehow incapable of understanding the long term historical ramifications of institutionalized open-ended racial preferences, that seem to violate the constitution.
He will probably never be perceptive enough to understand where he went wrong, but there is always hope that enough people will object to this particular institutionalized injustice to end it.
Cobra,
I was hoping that what you might find interesting in my post was that I trust black people to be able to succeed without AA, that black people have all the neccessary characteristics for such success already. It has already been proven by the success of black Americans today. Most blacks are not helpless victims. True, far too many are still mired in the inner cities and work needs to be done to remedy that, but AA is not that remedy. America needs the productive input from all its citizens, but preferences in elite schools will do nothing to reach that goal.
You on the other hand do not trust white Americans to be fair and that without the restraint of government would be back oppressing blacks. I think that an unfair and unrealistic appraisal of your fellow citizens. I think you are blind to the progress that has been made in the U.S. and unable to accept the fact the the clock CANNOT be turned back.
Further, the courts have already spoken that AA cannot be used for undoing historical wrongs (which is your argument), but rather only in ensuring “diversity” at schools.
I’d also like to respond to your distaste for “some of my best friends” arguments. I would agree with you that such statements often ring hollow and are often a substitute for doing nothing. On the other hand, due to my family’s cicumstances, I always lived in majority black neighborhoods, and I truly have had many (perhaps hundreds) of black friends, acquaintances, lovers, and enemies. I have slept in their beds, ate from their plates, laughed with them in joy, cried with them over their losses. I know how much pain racism and bigoty causes them. I have had my share of conflicts and ass-kickings, too. I am not without hypocrisy and prejudice, after all I’m only human. Many, perhaps most, of the families in my neighborhoods looked down on my family as lowlifes and white trash and not without good reason. I’ve been chased, spit upon, beat up and taunted by blacks for being different and disrespected. This did not make me hate blacks, because for every bad experience I can name many more good ones.
But I also know that blacks are capable of overcoming any adversity. Indeed, the very fact of their existance is proof of their remarkable ability to endure. I also know that all they need is the opportunity (like anyone else) and their talents and intelligence will take them as far as their imagination will propel them.
Unlike you, I believe that the barriers to success have all but been removed from American society. Does that mean that there doesn’t exist bigotry and prejudice? Of course not. But you do not need to be loved by everyone in order to succeed. Yes, some whites still hate blacks, but the numbers have diminished dramatically and they lack the power to stop black advancement. In fact, it is my belief that the biggest barrier to black advancement is internal, a lack of belief in themselves and their abilities. Again, I’m saying this as someone who knows and respects blacks as INDIVIDUALS.
Nobody,
It took me a while to respond, but that was a great post. It really was. Maybe you have a point about the trust factor that many people in my position have. I will grant you that I don’t really trust that America will turn into a meritocracy overnight. I have foundation and history backing me, but that’s not the reason I’m responding to your post. One of the things I really picked up from your post is that you have a faith in the goodness of man. You grew up in a situation that most whites in America never did, being that you actually lived among African Americans. You know that statistically, we as a nation are segregated. Because of that seperation, there is rampant mistrust from all sides. Mistrust is probably the biggest obstacle there is to relationships of any kind.
Nobody, you’re not wrong to want an America where everybody is viewed and treated equally, left to their own devices. I would LOVE to trust all of my fellow Americans, but I’ve got that “school zone traffic” mentality, where I’d like to believe that no motorist would dare speed in front of my neighborhood school , but I’m happy there are still speed limit signs in place, with traffic cops ready to enforce them.
–Cobra